The Old Joel on Software Forum: Part 4 (of 5) - Microsoft, Oracle build massive tech cities

Microsoft, Oracle build massive tech cities

http://www.silicon.com/research/specialreports/offshoring/0,3800003026,39120893,00.htm

<<Microsoft campus will be housed on 42.25 acres of land >>
Its around 12% as big as its Redmond campus. A massive investment, IMO.

<<Oracle is currently developing at Hi-Tec City. An Oracle spokeswoman told silicon.com the Hyderabad campus will be a 600,000 square foot office structure that will be ready in three years >>

Oracle already has around 2500 employees in Bangalore.

Both Will create around 4000 jobs and help Oracle and Microsoft remain competitive against each other. Oracle manages to develop 24/5 because of its development centres abroad.

Karthik
Saturday, May 29, 2004

Man, I hope both sides produce white papers and studies about lessons learned from this - what an awesome resource that would be.

Philo

Philo
Saturday, May 29, 2004

A question comes to mind.

Do we really need this much development?

Simon Lucy
Saturday, May 29, 2004

This reminds me of what used to happen in Europe, companies provided everything for the employee and you had basically a life long contract.

But when the market collapsed they had all of this and no use for it.

I say let some third party (joint venture perhaps) arrange those tech cities. Then you when the market falls. You can just packup and move to another country.

Blazit
Saturday, May 29, 2004

I'm told they're recruiting the gardeners and waiters from all the unemployed American programmers.

They're going to have a special shrine where they can all go and whine.

Stephen Jones
Saturday, May 29, 2004

A whine shrine!

Philo

Philo
Saturday, May 29, 2004

<<I'm told they're recruiting the gardeners and waiters from all the unemployed American programmers.>>

I will add my bit here. The main problem with outsourcing is that the pain is very tangible (lost jobs) and the gains are intangible.

For microsoft, they can get the same work at a lesser cost. This translates to

1)More money in the kitty for more investments in hardware and software benefiting (atleast in part) itself and other American companies like Intel, HP, Compaq.

2)More money means more taxes to the American government. This translates to better roads, better healthcare etc. And in Dubya's case more money for wars.

3)Most, if not all shareholders in Microsoft/Intel etc. are American.

4)India has no recourse other than buy hardware from US. More exports for US.

5)India, as Friedman pointed out is one of the few countries which is friendly to Americans. I mean, you can say you are American and not get shot. It is equally friendly as Europe.

6)You are helping lift a third world country out of poverty and it is a "showcase" for American values of Capitalism+Democracy.

7)More money in the bank in America. This means banks can lend out more money facilitating more investment.

So you see, Americans benefit in a myriad ways. None of it is directly apparent. Hence the uproar.

Karthik
Sunday, May 30, 2004

45 acres is that all? I've got 600 acres an hour outside of Albuquerque, 27 acres outside Flagstaff, and 71 acres in Sonoma Valley. Big deal!

Landowner
Sunday, May 30, 2004

But you don't have a population density of 336.62 persons per square kilometer. The US only has 29.77 persons per sq km. Land there is much scarcer.

(figures from http://www.photius.com/wfb1999/rankings/population_density_2.html)

Sunday, May 30, 2004

Could it be there are plenty of decent developers in India that don't fany relocating to the US?

Just me (Sir to you)
Monday, May 31, 2004

<,Could it be there are plenty of decent developers in India that don't fany relocating to the US?

Plenty, Lots of them are going back. Not because they were laid off , but because of oppurtunity

Karthik
Monday, May 31, 2004

"Man, I hope both sides produce white papers and studies about lessons learned from this - what an awesome resource that would be."

Philo:

Is it just you or all your team-mates at MS share this fake enthusiasm?

If you can make it, fake it(?)

[Disclaimer, I don't work for Microsoft, Philo does]

Jason
Wednesday, June 2, 2004

Jason:

What's with your obsession with Philo?

[Disclaimer, I think Jason is an idiot]

I am nobody
Wednesday, June 2, 2004

"I mean, you can say you are American and not get shot. It is equally friendly as Europe."

Sure about that? The part about not getting shot for being an American in Europe, I mean.

I get the sense there's a fair number of Europeans that would love to have a shot at an American these days. I suppose the lesser availability of firearms (compared to U.S.) reduces the risk somewhat, though.

Jim Rankin
Wednesday, June 2, 2004