The Old Joel on Software Forum: Part 4 (of 5)

SpamBayes

Some folks on this forum are delirious about SpamBayes...

But after wasting 2 hours trying to figure out how to make it work on the Windows platform, which came after 2 hours of figuring out how to make it work with Apache on my Linux box, my answer is: GET A DAMN INSTALLER!

There are many reasons why I chose against using Outlook. I do not see why an automated script can convert the latest source into an installable binary package for Windows and Linux.

That is my major problem on dealing with 'free' software -- I wasted over $200 worth of my time and efforts getting this to work.

It is a shame, since I really would like to find out if it can get my e-mails under control.

T.J.
Saturday, February 7, 2004

PostScript -- the person who decided that Python should require an "ctrl-Z" then "enter", and map the "quit" command to a comment instructing you to use the ‘right’ command, should be shot.

Heck, that person who decided to change it from Python 2.2 (“Ctrl-D”) also should be shot.

(For the clueless -- If I can type "quit" and get that message... Why not just shut up and let me quit anyway?)

T.J.
Saturday, February 7, 2004

http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/spambayes/SpamBayes-Outlook-Setup-0081.exe?download

SpamBayes-Outlook-Setup-0081.exe

www.MarkTAW.com
Saturday, February 7, 2004

I thought Linux guys were used to compiling and configuring.... :P

www.MarkTAW.com
Saturday, February 7, 2004

Mark --

Lemme quote what I said:

"There are many reasons why I chose against using Outlook."

I use Calypso because it is better than Outlook for me.

-T.J.

T.J.
Saturday, February 7, 2004

Yeah sorry, I jumped the gun a bit there.

I do wish SpamBeyes would somehow work with Thunderbird, but it comes with it's own bayesian spam filter that works well enough for me. No false negatives, and about 80-90% effectiveness in identifying spam.

www.MarkTAW.com
Saturday, February 7, 2004

I got it installed on my windows machine in about 15 minutes. What problem did you have?

Note that it will work with any email client if you set your email client to pull from localhost and have spambayes serve as the relay.

I'm using it with outlook express.

lr
Saturday, February 7, 2004

I would love it if they build a plugin for Thunderbird, although I do want to wait a few more generations as I didn't really have much success with Thunderbird 0.4 in equaling if not bettering Calypso (and I was SO ready to dump Calypso... that stupid feature of requiring you to wait 2 seconds before the e-mail is set as read... ugh.)

As for installing -- it is all about trying to get Python to behave nicely. I have no experience with Python as a development environment, and very little of it as an execution environment. Just compile it, package it, and use an installer to put everything where you want it.

As for the Linux users being used to compile and install -- I'm too old for that now. I compile and install with my own programs, and I am already using scripts to make it automatic. If I can do it, why can't they? (Remember, this is not your simple ./configure && ./make && ./make install procedure SpamBayes want you to do.)

T.J.
Saturday, February 7, 2004

If you just need a spam filter for a POP3 mail client under Windows... and you still can't get SB to install... give K9 a try. I've been using it for a couple of months now, and am very satisfied with it.

http://www.keir.net/k9.html

Just unzip, add this to Windows' StartUp directory so it runs at boot-time, run, and set up your email client to connect to localhost on port 9999, with login = pop.isp.net/110/mylogin

FredF
Saturday, February 7, 2004

My original goal was to have a centralized location within my internal network to handle mail (and all the spam that comes with it), and can be accessed securely from anywhere (securely = encryption and passwords). That went out the window when I realize that the best solution was to take a lot of time, learn the email systems, its variety of options, and so on...

I really do not have time for it. I shudder to wonders how parents could manage their time with their kids and still stay ahead of the pack in their career. I am already extremely busy learning about new technology for development, and new concepts for Data Warehousing. Well, not new -- but new to me. I have no time to just sit down in front of my Linux box and figure things out. This is the #1 reason why I switched from Gentoo to Fedora Core 1.

After all, if I take the time and effort to do that, where will I have the time to have fun? Having fun help me preserve my sanity, after all.

So after listening to my rant, could someone recommend very user-friendly (as in point-and-click) tool that would do what I want (be able to pop3/smtp to it from anywhere and get mail, or even better -- have a webmail interface, with pop3/smtp within the local network?) Oh yeah, archiving mail in some standard format would be nice too...

Thanks for the k9 reference, will look at it tonight or tomorrow.

T.J.
Saturday, February 7, 2004

Have a look at http://assp.sourceforge.net/ It's a server side SMTP proxy done in Perl.

Has some good walkthroughs on the site so it shouldn't take you more than an hour to set up. I've been using it for the last few weeks with great success.

Damian
Saturday, February 7, 2004

Squirrel Mail does mail via a web interface. You'd have to worry about your own SSL. I doubt it does spam filtering.

www.MarkTAW.com
Saturday, February 7, 2004

.. and I don't think it's a server. :)

www.MarkTAW.com
Saturday, February 7, 2004

I use fetchmail (which is easy to configure) to grab email from POP3 servers and store it on my central Linux machine. Then I SSH into the Linux machine to read my mail.

It works great, but not if you want a GUI email client. In that case, you'd probably have to set up an IMAP server, which is not something you can do in 5 minutes. (also GUI email client support of IMAP tends to be pretty slow and crappy)

Dan Maas
Saturday, February 7, 2004

If you want an easy to install bayesian-esque mail filter try popfile. It has a proper windows installer, and you can use the Outclass Outlook plugin so you have a nice toolbar to control popfile in Outlook.

Popfile http://popfile.sourceforge.net

Outclass http://www.vargonsoft.com/Outclass/

Matthew Lock
Saturday, February 7, 2004

I second the K9 recommendation. 99.2% accuracy, only one false positive in ~2,000 mails. (but I also started by manually classifying an inbox of ~300 mails, just to speed things up)

Martin Dittus
Sunday, February 8, 2004

"""(For the clueless -- If I can type "quit" and get that message... Why not just shut up and let me quit anyway?)"""

Because 'quit' is a *string variable*:

Python 2.2.2 (#37, Oct 14 2002, 17:02:34) [MSC 32 bit (Intel)] on win32
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> quit
'Use Ctrl-Z plus Return to exit.'
>>> quit.upper()
'USE CTRL-Z PLUS RETURN TO EXIT.'
>>> quit[-5:-1]
'exit'
>>>

The 'quit' variable was created as a quick fix so people who were trying to get out of the interpreter would be able to get some help. 'quit' is not part of the language, so making it *do* something isn't possible.

As for the choice of Ctrl-Z and the need to hit enter, talk to Microsoft. That's the end-of-file marker for DOS and Windows programs. On Unix it's Ctrl-D, and the enter isn't necessary. In contrast to Java (which tries to make every platform look the same), Python tries to adhere to the conventions of the platform it's running under.

Phillip J. Eby
Monday, February 9, 2004

You missed my point:

String variable or not, just do it. I do not CARE if you would throw out all kind of 'impossibilities' - if it is possible to print out a message saying "do it this way", it is possible to actually quit.

Period. No discussion. Any other solution is not user-friendly.

T.J.
Wednesday, February 11, 2004