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IEEE reports highest level of unemployment ever
> [IEEE] reports "the highest level of member unemployment ever recorded, more than double the levels reached in the recession periods of the mid-1970s and early 1990s." Since U.S. IEEE members were far less likely to be out of work than their non-IEEE counterparts, these estimates are probably optimistic. The data portend a sharp decline in the overall demand for electrical, electronics, and computer engineers.
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=36322
That little tidbit I was not aware of - twice the unemployment level for qualified member engineers from the worse time it ever was!
Maybe things aren't really getting better after all.
Tony Chang
Friday, December 26, 2003
Much of the media here in America is controlled by the republicans. Only fools(there is no other word for it) believe CNN and NY Times when the say that economy is looking up.
They have their own agendas and many of these dont coincide with human values like telling the truth.
So you can pretty much guess that most of these statistics that claim that economy is improving are simply exagerrated by the media. They are hungry for 4 more years of Bush.
anon
Friday, December 26, 2003
The coincidence between IEEE membership and those involved in the computer industry (who are not in the first instance electronic engineers) has become so little as to be irrelevant and probably misdirecting when trying to apply it to hiring trends.
It may well show a general deskilling of electronic design (beyond primary research that is), in that a great many products can now be created purely by plugging them together like the proverbial lego.
It may also show a decline in R&D budgets as the concentration on practical applications and products seems to relate more to innovation in styling than fundamental technology.
Simon Lucy
Friday, December 26, 2003
Simon, I don't know what you base that on. A very high proportion of IEEE members work in the computer and software industries. Are you making the mistake of thinking the IEEE is only for electronics designers?
Friday, December 26, 2003
Tony Chang wrote, "Maybe things aren't really getting better after all."
For the U.S. computer industry this statement might be very true, however, that doesn't mean other sectors of the U.S. economy aren't doing okay.
One Programmer's Opinion
Friday, December 26, 2003
Here's a related article:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=572&e=2&u=/nm/germany_east_men_dc
>Shortage of Women in East Germany Causes Turmoil
>LIEBENTHAL, Germany (Reuters) - A steady exodus of educated women is worsening a gender gap among eastern Germany's young and could be sowing the seeds of social upheaval.
People wonder why there are no women in engineering. The answer is simple -- when smart women see a dead-end situationwe either high tail it out of there, or avoid it like the plague to begin with. Why? Because women have common sense. The IT field has as much going for it right now as living in East Germany. Only losers with no skills and no other prospects would stay on board this sinking ship.
Charlotte C.
Friday, December 26, 2003
"Only losers with no skills and no other prospects would stay on board this sinking ship"
Bwahahaha. There are many of us making extremely good livings and with absolutely no issue getting gigs that would beg to differ. The reality is indeed that the dregs (and unfortunately some talented people with poor communications/self-sales skills), such as yourself, are getting flushed out, but what is coming out of all of that is a much more mature profession.
Anonymizer
Friday, December 26, 2003
anon,
"media here in America is controlled by the republicans"
"They are hungry for 4 more years of Bush"
Ha Ha - you got me. For a second there I thought you were serious.
sgf
Friday, December 26, 2003
Isn't the raw number of employed engineers still higher than it was before the start of the dot-com boom and the Y2K frenzy?
The all-time high unemployment rate may be more the result of an all-time high number of individuals chasing after the back-to-reality number of jobs.
T. Norman
Friday, December 26, 2003
Anonymizer, it is not true that the people without work are the worst, or are no good. In fact, contractors, who tend to be the more capable, in the business market at least, are the hardest hit by the downturn.
The full impact of what's been happening is not readily apparent to those with staff jobs until they're forced to find a new job.
Anonymizer
Friday, December 26, 2003
anon,
"media here in America is controlled by the republicans"
"They are hungry for 4 more years of Bush"
Ha Ha - you got me. For a second there I thought you were serious.
sgf
Friday, December 26, 2003
Isn't the raw number of employed engineers still higher than it was before the start of the dot-com boom and the Y2K frenzy?
The all-time high unemployment rate may be more the result of an all-time high number of individuals chasing after the back-to-reality number of jobs.
a
Friday, December 26, 2003
Please excuse the excessive paste.
a
Friday, December 26, 2003
Anon,
Read the article on East Germany. Is it the dregs who stay behind or is it the dregs who move on to a better life. The article points out that the ones wha stay behind in a dead end area are mental rejects who will be unlikely to ever have an opportunity to breed.
Charlotte C.
Friday, December 26, 2003
Uh....the IT sector isn't East Germany moron. Poorly placed analogies are the truest sign of idiots.
Anonymizer
Friday, December 26, 2003
You're a Nazi!
Salad Cream!
You're a Nazi!
Salad Cream!
[Godwin & JoS in a shouting match]
Philo
Philo
Friday, December 26, 2003
"Much of the media here in America is controlled by the republicans. Only fools(there is no other word for it) believe CNN and NY Times when the say that economy is looking up."
That's funny...Yeah, CNN is just a shill for Bush. LOL.
And you keep telling yourself that the sky is falling and that you're doomed. The more people that wallow in self-pity and convince themselves that the end is coming means that the rest of us have more opportunities to choose from.
Only fools (there is no other word for it) sit around and work hard to convince themselves how bad off they have it.
I hate Whiners
Saturday, December 27, 2003
> Only fools sit around and work hard to convince themselves how bad off they have it.
As the frog said to the other frog as they relaxed in the pot of water on top of the stove.
a
Saturday, December 27, 2003
Wow, I've never heard less convincing arguments that the sky is falling. Women are avoiding IT, therefore it's a dud. CNN backs Bush, and is lying about a recovery.
Things are a lot more complex than what the IEEE report is being used for in this thread. There are certain facts:
1) The number of jobs in the US is increasing;
2) The number of UI claims is decreasing;
3) The stock market is going up, and has been for months;
4) Consumer and business spending are up;
5) Consumer confidence is up.
As the economy improves, all the things that companies stopped working on (like implementing database systems to track their dodads and gizmos) will come back to life, because they'll have the money again to pursue them. This leads to an increase in software company income. So, all the things that software companies stopped doing because they didn't have enough money will come back to life. This will require more people, and that will lead to increased hires. These new hires will suddenly be making more money, and thus will be spending money on things. People who produce these things will make more money, hire more people and pursue more technology.
This is, of course, an incredibly simplified version of what is going on. However, I've been seeing it first hand. Our company just had the best year in our history (the last 9 months brought in more money than the 12 before that). We are getting more orders, at a higher price per order. Decision times are reducing... what used to take 4 to 6 months is down to 2 to 4 months.
So cry doom if you want; however, instead of making ignorant comments about women having more common sense than men, start looking at some hard numbers and realistic scenerios.
Tim Sullivan
Saturday, December 27, 2003
"As the frog said to the other frog as they relaxed in the pot of water on top of the stove. "
Yeah, and you just keep telling yourself that you're that frog. That'll really help your outlook on life, prosperity and the job market.
I Hate Whiners
Sunday, December 28, 2003
But if I know I'm that frog, I'm going to jump out of the pot. Sleep well.
a
Sunday, December 28, 2003
"But if I know I'm that frog, I'm going to jump out of the pot. Sleep well. "
Excellent! One less incompetent, whining hack out of the industry.
And yes..I would like fries with that. Thank you.
I Hate Whiners
Sunday, December 28, 2003
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