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Friend still can't open my site

I posted this awhile back, before upgrading to 2.0, but I never did not get it solved.  I have a friend who wants to read my blog but can't open it.  All he gets is the first line at the top of the page and then it stops loading.  He is using a powermac with AOL.  I know, AOL, but he still should be able to view a simple html site.  There must be an error in the html code in the template that his browser is getting stuck on.

Here is my site address;

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Jim Arter
Tuesday, January 13, 2004

Your HTML doesn't validate. That may have something to do with it.

Troy King
Tuesday, January 13, 2004

I have no experience with AOL whatsoever (thankfully ;-) ), but if you think that the problem is the HTML, you should fix the things that the W3C MarkUp Validator reports:

Henrik Jernevad (
Tuesday, January 13, 2004

It works fine in my AOL 7 on my PC. I've never had a problem viewing anything in AOL. But your friend can use IE once he logs into AOL.

There is lots of paste-in-from-Word html junk in there that may cause a problem for him like that might choke on some Mac's:
<span style="mso-spacerun: yes"> and

<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt">&nbsp;<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /?>

It's just not a great thing to paste from Word because it brings all that junk with it. I usually paste from Word to Notepad to CityDesk to clean it out.

He may have something old or screwed up on his machiine.

Tuesday, January 13, 2004

tk :re paste-in-from-Word html junk

If you're a MS Office user that stuff you labeled as junk works just great as long as you stay within IE. If on the other hand you're using a browser other than IE it may be problematic.

Since IE dominates the world of computing as does MS Office [which includes Word] I would state that what you label as junk is GOLD to those that want [and need] MS office integration.

Since CD produces excellent HTML as does MS Word I suspect that the powermac with AOL combination has some “filter” set that is generating a block from the browser perspective.

Since most mac users are clueless [technically] the powermack user needs to have the browser configuration settings checked by someone who knows what to look for

David Mozer
Tuesday, January 13, 2004

I have a client who was using aol 7  (maybe 8) on a mac.  The site I was designing was unreadable.  I loaded mac IE 5.? and it worked fine for her.  You can download mac ie5.x from Microsoft or evolt I imagine.  You have such a small amount of css styling, though, so I'm not sure that is the problem.  Maybe publish the page without the css and see how it looks for your friend.  If the page still doesn't display, try the divide and conquer method with the html:  cut out half of the html, then publish.  If that works, cut out the other half and publish.  One half probably won't work.  Maybe both won't.  Take one have, divide again.  and so forth.

There have been posts here relating to how to strip the Word stuff out of html.  TK's links will probably help you find those posts.

joel goldstick
Tuesday, January 13, 2004

I appreciate the MS feature but it's often creates surprises  when folks paste into CityDesk.

I built a site for a guy who updates it himself. All his additions are paste-in's from Word. You never know how he's formated his Word stuff. So over time the site has accumulated chunks of giant text, tiny text, different fonts, and everything in between.

I never realized that it could also keep some folks from viewing a site.

Wednesday, January 14, 2004

tk :re creates surprises  when folks paste into CityDesk.

Yes 4sure assuming you're looking for broad browser support -- however my point is that as long as you stay within the MS world it will not be an issue "rather" it will be a great help.

"All his additions are paste-in's from Word. You never know how he's formatted his Word stuff. So over time the site has accumulated chunks of giant text, tiny text, different fonts, and everything in between."

Have you ever given thought to the concept that "he" did his styling stuff in word because that is the way he wanted his presentation to look and Word enabled him to do so "otherwise why use those features? I call that enabling the user.

BTW, is not CityDesk built on MS technologies? and should not CityDesk retain the level of integration that MS has built into its framework? [Rhetorical].

The challenge in my opinion is to produce HTML that emulates the formatting of MS Office documents.—Why? Because MS technologies dominate the world of computing from an end-user perspective and that makes good business sense unless you hate MS.

David Mozer
Wednesday, January 14, 2004


The word processors add codes and such so that the html file could be brought back into a wordprocessor and retain the formatting. 

I don't use Word, but the word processor I use does this, and I assume Word does as well.  This can be very helpful, however, it is possible to retain the formatting AND get rid of the extra codes that Word puts in.  Especially if you are just wanting a display page only, there is no need for the extraneous coding.  That extra coding can also slow the loading of pages.

Junk is basically something you find worthless, and in some situations, that stuff is worthless.  Situations are always different, so what is needed is also different

There are some commercial Word HTML cleaners which do a fairly good job.

Plus, if the result is more compatibility with other browsers, thats great

Jeff Kolker
Wednesday, January 14, 2004

Jeff :re and retain the formatting

It all depends what one's *objectives* are -- MS Office provides "many features" and saving the Word document in HTML format as a Web Page while removing Office specific tags and then reopening the file in Office programs, text and general appearance will be preserved, but some “features” may work differently. The idea behind what MS does may not be to your liking but it does work for the great majority of Office users who like to exploite the power of enabling technology. So what may be junk to you etc. etc.

David Mozer
Wednesday, January 14, 2004

Thanks for everyone's input, it led to an interesting exchange.  I use Word to write my articles and then paste in the text because Word has many editing features that CD does not include.  It's a little moot because I have stopped using most of those features (such as selecting a different font) in an effort to keep my html cleaner to solve the browser compatibility problem.  It's also interesting that AOL can't open a site that Netscape (which AOL owns) and IE can open (which AOL uses).  AOL's browser is based on some sort of bastardized version of IE, even though they own Netscape.

I have tried to validate my code using online validators and I see the errors listed, but because I don't use html, which is one reason I wanted CityDesk, I don't know how to correct all of them.

Since my AOL using, Mac powered, friend can't even open my main site page, I assume that the errors are in my template which I downloaded from CD (and has errors built in if you check it before changing it, it says its not a valid version of html) and tried not to "mess it up" too much.  I have also given my friend a link directly to an article so he could bypass the template page and that didn't work for him either, so he can't load either one.

I will keep working on it and will no doubt learn something about html, that I didn't set out to learn, in the process.

Jim Arter
Wednesday, January 14, 2004

Jim Arter :re I assume that the errors are in my template

I understand why you are assuming what you are -- however I do not believe that the problem is being caused by CityDesk or your template.

AOL does *a lot of propriety things* with their re-engineered browsers and all you need to do is find someone who understands "that version of the browser your friend is using" and change some of the configuration settings. OR suggest that your friend change to IE for the PowerMac.

David Mozer
Wednesday, January 14, 2004

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