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The Chinese government strongly supports piracy

In a suprise move by the Chinese Academy of Engineering Physics they are now hosting one of the largest crack sites in the world - 0daycn.net.

0daycn.net, part of the fixdown crack network, boasts of creating cracks within 1 day of a software title being released. They achieve this by monitoring download websites, publishers EXEs and PAD files.

The Chinese Academy of Engineering Physics, also known as the Southwest Institute, is the primary design laboratory for Chinese nuclear weapons, located in Mianyang (Sichuan). Mian Yang city lies on the northern tip of the Chengdu Plain.

So in effect the Chinese Government is supporting the cracking of your software. Perhaps you would like to thanks them for making the world a better place?

http://www.sitp.ac.cn/
sitp@sunm.shcnc.ac.cn

Jericho
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

Although you seem to have an unhealthy fixation on the rampant use of pirated software in the far east, that's pretty useful information.

You still haven't told any of us at fog creek software which shareware you've written. Enlighten us! :-)

Li-fan Chen
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

> Although you seem to have an unhealthy
> fixation on the rampant use of pirated
> software in the far east, that's pretty
> useful information.

I don't care about the rampant use of pirated software in the far east. They live in poor countries. When one's salary is $100, let's be realistic, they can't buy software.

BUT, the problem is the pirated software & cracks sites located in China are known by many people in the US and West Europe.

Even if the sites are in Chinese language, people in the US enter the name of the program they want in the search box, find it, and download it.


> You still haven't told any of us at fog creek
> software which shareware you've written.
> Enlighten us! :-)

I won't tell you, because I don't want my web site to be the target of a huge DDOS. The crackers can and will take revenge.

I do as much as I can against them, and also protect myself and my company.


BTW - it seems that 0day.cn is down for the moment. :) Maybe they stopped hosting it.

Jericho
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

> I won't tell you, because I don't want
> my web site to be the target of a huge
> DDOS. The crackers can and will take
> revenge.

I mean, if I post my web site address in the forum, they will probably attack my site.

Also, there are many ways you can hurt a shareware company:

Most serious shareware companies pay for transfer for their web hosting, because they want to offer fast downloads.

If you have a fast connection, you can do a lot of damage by downloading their software again and again.

Also, if they advertise using Google or Overture, you can also do some minor damage, altough this is harder than going for their downloads hosting.

Jericho
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

Well then email it to me. Click on the link that says Li-fan Chen and fill it in. I am just curious what sort of software you write.

Li-fan Chen
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

It might be naive to assume that because the site appears to be used for an illegitimate purpose that the owners of the site are aware of it.

The actual machine might not even be part of their network.

Simon Lucy
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

You also fail to give us a connection between the people who own the servers, this Southwestern Institute, and the Chinese government, other than that they design nuclear weapons.

This reminds me of that senator who said anyone who pirates software, music, etc. should have physical harm done to their computer - a digital rights managements program that can physically destroy a hard drive - and unwittingly had an illegal copy of a DHTML script on his website. I'm sure he wasn't aware that this pirated DHTML script is what his designer used. Also, the actions of one person in the US government, depending on your point of view I guess, should not be seen as support from the whole government.

Mark T A W .com
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

The Chinese government has a state-sponsered translation effort to convert textbooks that are considered to be particularly good into Chinese so that they can be studied by Chinese students.

Given that China does not accept copyright or patent law there is no reason why their government shouldn't support this kind of effort for the benefit of their people.

Mr Jack
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

Oh, just as a side note, since allot of US universities have had serious issues with file sharing and copyrighted music, they must support it.

fw
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

The problem with not supporting copyright is that there's an issue of reciprocity. We don't sign international copyright treaties because we're nice decent people - we sign international copyright treaties so people in those countries don't steal our stuff.

So - China is leeching now, but what happens when they need to break out of their borders? When they start producing software that's worth having (which is the real threat, right?), if they don't want it stolen instead of bought then at some point they're going to have to start working and respecting the copyright system.

Unless they simply never export software. Then there are threats regarding lower cost of manufacturing, but I feel it won't work that way - software developers are too hyperactive to stay contained...

Philo

Philo
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

Jericho,
please stop spreading rumours and false statements. 0daycn.net is nowhere near creating those cracks as you've implied. Instead they provide a download facility for cracks and keygens created by the scene (ROR, CORE etc.), possibly leeched off 0-day sites.
Also, note that major suites which cost some grand (like VS.Net or Office 2003) are not and will not be available on that site for obvious reasons.
Furthermore, much of the downloads can already be obtained through the major P2P networks. As a consequence you'd have to say that South Korea promotes piracy just because they have the widest proliferation of broadband access, which is just as silly as your topic.

"The Chinese government strongly supports piracy" - given the facts, I'd say this is just another attempt to degrade this forum down to yellow press standards.

Joel, please delete this thread.

Some posters strongly support idiocy
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

Jericho still hasn't send me a link to "his shareware" or "his shareware company". Either he is incredibly paranoid, or full of it. Either way, in some ways he is too pathetic to even be considered a closet racist. What a waste of life.

Li-fan Chen
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

"When they start producing software that's worth having (which is the real threat, right?), "

As someone who has spent considerable time working in Shanghai and Tokyo, I almost burst out laughing when I read this. The japanese and chinese are very good at many things, but writing software is not one of them. Any good chinese developers are living in north america or europe.

I doubt the chinese will ever become an international software powerhouse. However, they will become an international biotech powerhouse, because they have no laws restricting embryo research, stem cell research, etc.

rz
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

"Oh, just as a side note, since allot of US universities have had serious issues with file sharing and copyrighted music, they must support it"

Well, one could argue that >95% of a typical university's network load is used for things very far removed from "academic" usage (mostly P2P abuse, porn etc.), so in a sense they are supporting it, no?

Just me (Sir to you)
Tuesday, October 07, 2003

Mr. Jack,

In college, the Chinese students had bound books, printed by the Chinese government and given to them, with all the tests, quizzes, etc that had been given by a professor teaching a given class. Also included were step by step explanations in Chinese. When a student got signed up for his engineering or science class, he reported which one to his advisor back home and a few days later he got a shipment of the books taylored to that professor. He also collected the latest quizzes and tests and mailed the back to China to be included in the next revision. The students acknowledged that they did this and the professors knew about it and thought it was pretty wild that their government went to so much trouble to make sure they did well. The work paid off -- when the job fairs came around, the Chinese and middle-eastern students who studied nuclear physics and control systems were courted heavily by the US defense conntractors. White students were told there were no positions available.

UCSD grad
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

I get this strange feeling that we have a full time troll on JOS now.. .oO(now we can start a fan club and print t-shirts!!)

Li-fan Chen
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

"The work paid off -- when the job fairs came around, the Chinese and middle-eastern students who studied nuclear physics and control systems were courted heavily by the US defense conntractors."

Uh, this shouldn't make me feel nervous, should it?  I mean, we're not talking about Americans of foreign descent, we're talking about American defense contractors exclusively recruiting non-citizens to work on nuclear technology.

Who me worry?

Jim Rankin
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

Furthermore, re: racism.

The criticisms have been of a GOVERNMENT, not a race of people.  Even then, it's not so much a criticism as an observation.  China does not respect intellectual property laws.  This may or may not come back to bite them in the future.

Don't know how you can construe this as racism.

Jim Rankin
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

"The work paid off -- when the job fairs came around, the Chinese and middle-eastern students who studied nuclear physics and control systems were courted heavily by the US defense conntractors. White students were told there were no positions available. "

This is bullshit. I don't even know any "white students" who study control systems or nuclear physics. The reason why there are so many asians/middle eastern/eastern european people in nuclear engineering and stuff involving control systems is because your standard white american simply doesn't study this stuff. It is the same reason why there aren't any white americans writing compilers anymore: because no one studies this stuff in america. And why would you? If you put in 12 years at school studying nuclear physics, you are looking at $45,000 working 12 hour days in some academic or government lab. In contrast, you could work 12 years at wendy's and end up making more money.

rz
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

OK, well, instead of white substitute american. Didn't mean it to be a race issue as there are plenty of immigrants who have contributed great things. Yes it does concern me since I see a pattern of top secret clearances and defense research projects being populated and controlled almost entirely by noncitizens from countries that are know to be far from friendly towards the US -- the Chinese for example (and I mean Chinese as a nation not a race) still have their dirty nuke ICBMS preprogrammed and targetted with US cities as primary targets, to save that extra few minutes of entering the coordinates when it comes time to launch.

It's true that nuclear physics programs at leading US universities and all fields relating are almost entirely populated by noncitizens from unfriendly nations. But there are a few american students as well, who are ignored by defense contractor screeners for many top contractors -- such as Raydeon. I'm american, of hispanic background. MSEE with focus on control systems. Summa Cum Laude, with research experience and publications. Contractors didn't even want to look at my resume and refused to set up interviews, while foreign students (from China, Iraq, and Saudi Arabia whom I personally knew from my classes) were courted and blessed. It's not a race issue -- for whatever reason some of these companies WANT to hire only non-nationals. I had thought in the past that nonnationals could not get the clearances and that certain jobs are for 'citizens only' due to security concerns. The strange and mysterious reality is that exceptions are not just made, but that exceptions are the rule.

I ended up working as a software engineer instead of missles like I wanted to. It's water under the bridge for me and I've moved on but I do think that the public should know what is going on. The Wen Ho Lee Los Alamos case is just the tip of the iceberg. When it comes down to it, we will find ourselves defenseless against aggressors with powerful WMDs that we ourselves have paid to develop.

I've tried to get my congressional representatives interested but they don't care. I've reported my concerns to the NSA and they don't care either. Everyone in government is very comfortable with the way things are. The Chinese government pays off US politicians left and right. The middle eastern countries are not taken seriously as a threat, even after 911. The government, the universities and the defense industry are all a hotbed of corruption and payola.

Sit in in a graduate class in nuclear physics and any leading US university with a good physics program. Check out graduate level EE classes. Check out which students get the hires and the grants to assist with research. Native born students are completely disenfranchised here and it is intentional.

Foreign students pay more for tuition that natives. Universities give priority admissions to these students because it's more money for them. There are plenty of US students who are well-qualified and want to study these subjects. Arguments that there are not enough native born students seeking these studies or that they are loss qualified than fergein students are total BS propaganda and utterly false.

UCSD grad
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

well, it does make sense that US defense contractors want to hire iraqi, chinese, saudi nationals, because then not only do they have a nuke engineer, they also have someone who can speak chinese, arabic, whatever they speak in iraq.

the FBI and CIA also show strong preference to hiring people who natively speak chinese, arabic and korean these days.

you also might have just gone to the wrong school. my friends at MIT have no problem getting jobs at lincoln labs, draper, and defense contractors in VA.

rz
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

... open-source ... china ... india ... outsource ... h1b ... microsoft ... linux ...

*yawn*

trollfeast
Wednesday, October 08, 2003

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