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SourceGear Vault vs SourceOffSite vs SourceSafe

I have proposed to my company to evaluate SourceGear Vault as an alternative to SourceSafe/SourceOffSite.

There are 3-4 developers using SOS, and 20+ using VSS (i'm one of the SOS folks).  SOS/VSS drive me crazy, and must cost me at least 45 mins a day in lost productivity.

I have heard from the Vault mailing list that Vault's client is much faster than SOS for over-VPN, but slightly slower than VSS for local access.

Does anyone have any experience with Vault they could share?  One of the other dev groups in the company is rather adverse to change, so the transition and resulting performance must be the same or exceed VSS for local access.  Our repository is about 2.5GB in size.

Thanks!

le bob
Friday, June 13, 2003

Dont forget to consider perforce (unless you really need the "Share" functionality - can't think why :) )

http://www.perforce.com

Richard
Friday, June 13, 2003

Or CVS and all it's variants.

wincvs
cvsnt
cvsweb
tortoise

   
Friday, June 13, 2003

I highly recommend tortoise for any windows CVS uses out there.

Gregor Brandt
Friday, June 13, 2003

I'll second the recommendation for looking at CVS.

I primarily work in Visual Studio.NET so I use SS for local projects, but for anything that requires remote users I switch over to CVS.

It's a bit of a hassle at first when you come from SS, but once you climb that little learning curve it's an enormously powerful, and free, tool.

Mark Hoffman
Friday, June 13, 2003

TortoiseCVS works amazingly well. Give it a try. It's free.

Matt Christensen
Friday, June 13, 2003

I'll second the recommendation for tortoise.  When we switched from SS I wanted a client that took less than 5 minutes to learn.  Tortoise fit the bill:  I was able to get up to speed almost instantly.  As a bonus, I've been able to 'grow' into CVS.  We run CVS on a linux box, but I know that there's some CVS implementations for Windows too.

Also recommend ExamDiff.

http://www.prestosoft.com/ps.asp?page=edp_examdiff
http://www.tortoisecvs.org/

Best of all, they are free.

   
Friday, June 13, 2003

I use VSS in a side project, and CVS at work. VSS is lame lame lame, from the 1996-era installer to the not being able to check out the same thing to multiple users.

CVS, on the other hand, is beautiful. My Linux box runs as a CVS server, and does my nightly builds. From Explorer I can use TortoiseCVS, but I generally just use the awesome CVS integration in IntelliJ.

Also, CVS is free free free.

Fred2000
Friday, June 13, 2003

Yes, well if it was up to me I'd go with CVS completely, but outside of our group of 5 developers, the other 25 are deathly afraid of change, any sort of change.

And unfortunately due to 20 years of code base, my group and  other groups have code bases that are intertwined in source control, using the stupid 'share' feature in VSS.  Grrrr.

So really the only alternative that will get us off VSS is another package that looks like VSS, but is better. Which is why I'd like feedback on Vault (MS SQL backed).

Thanks!

le bob
Friday, June 13, 2003

ClearCase supports "links" for what that's worth; I migrated a VSS repository to ClearCase.

Christopher Wells
Friday, June 13, 2003

Have you demonstrated tortoisecvs?
Explorer integration is really cool.
Of course you do lose the Visual Studio integration, but apparently it can be integrated with VC6 or so.

mb
Friday, June 13, 2003

Wait, somehow your code is tied to VSS? It can't work unless you use VSS?

Fred2000
Friday, June 13, 2003

My experience has been that the major need for VS integration -- check-out before editing -- is really not required with CVS. I suppose I do miss the prompt about files being added to the project should also be added to the source database, but in practice, it's just much effort to hunt down the files that you haven't yet added as part of your merge & commit effort (once you get into the groove of it, anyway).

But I digress... given the requirements for something that works just like VSS, then CVS is definitely NOT the right choice. Of course, I count this as a bonus in CVS's column, not in VSS's column, but that's just me. :)

Brad Wilson (dotnetguy.techieswithcats.com)
Friday, June 13, 2003

Should be "it's just not much effort". :-p

Brad Wilson (dotnetguy.techieswithcats.com)
Friday, June 13, 2003

Just as a quick comment, VSS does have multi-checkout functionality, though it has to be enabled in the administration (because some developer groups just aren't capable of handling merges). Having said that, there is no doubt whatsoever that VSS is lacking in he branching/SDLC arena.

Dennis Forbes
Friday, June 13, 2003


Le Bob,

Apparently we don't have too many Vault users here on Joel's forum yet.  Perhaps that will change with our upcoming 1.1 release, which has FogBUGZ integration.  ;-)

If we can be of any help to you, feel free to contact me.

Eric W. Sink
Friday, June 13, 2003

My company switched to Vault from VSS.  The transition was painless.  The UI is similar enough to VSS that long-time VSS users will pick it up right away.

Vault is a quality product that basically works.  You can't say that for VSS.

Bill Carlson
Friday, June 13, 2003

[CVS, on the other hand, is beautiful.]

Try getting a guy in marketing ora  complete n00b to understand "import".. "wait so I import it to another machine? How is that an import?"

trollbooth
Friday, June 13, 2003

If you're interested in an up and comer, try Subversion.  It's a replacement for CVS that is designed to overcome its shortfalls.  It deals with irritations like not being able to version directories or moves.  It also has support for metadata, constant time branching, atomic commits, and many other nice things, but it's pretty much as easy to use as CVS.  It's been self-hosting for months and is nice and stable.  Still working towards 1.0 though.

Nick Brosnahan
Friday, June 13, 2003

If you use Tortoise the only thing your users really have to care about is:
Update
Commit
Add Contents

It was easier to teach my boss TortoiseCVS than it was sharing a .Net web project.

Philo

Philo
Saturday, June 14, 2003

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