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Contributor Edition

You say that the Contributor Edition will be a lot cheaper than the Profesional Edition. But what is stopping me from getting the Free version to set up the site, and then "only" buy the CE to publish articles? That way I could save a lot of money and work around the 50 file limit.

Thomas D
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Good point. Maybe they'll make the .cty file incompatible, with a one-way conversion only availble in the pro edition.

www.marktaw.com
Saturday, July 26, 2003

I'm not sure, but obviously we're not creating the Contributor Edition as a way for crafty people to pay less for CityDesk. There are a number of ways we could do this.

Some of my ideas:
1) Contributor Edition only works on files that were created with the Pro Edition
2) Contributor Edition is not for sale standalone, but only in packages including one copy of the Pro Edition
3) Starter Edition can't open sites with more than 50 pages... a stricter rule than the current rule that allows the Starter Edition to *publish* sites with more than 50 pages.
4) Only one Edition can be installed on a given computer at a given time
5) Trust that people won't figure this out

Any suggestions?

Joel Spolsky
Saturday, July 26, 2003

1 & 2 sound like the best... 1 sounds just like my idea, so of course I like it.

How about this one.

CityDesk free only works with one site, and it's actually somehow part of the .exe, it doesn't create a .cty file at all.

www.marktaw.com
Saturday, July 26, 2003

.. though that would suck because you're taking away some things people previously had, but if it's really sort of an evaluation version....

I needed to play with CD free for a while before I decided to buy it... including creating several sites.

www.marktaw.com
Saturday, July 26, 2003

It would nice to be able to keep the work one have done with the eval version when purchasing. So if one would use the integrated thingey, the upgrade procedure would need to be able to extract the site. Which sounds as if it's a bit too much work...

Fredrik Jacobsson
Saturday, July 26, 2003

I don't see why you can't put a flag in the .cty file that changes depending on what program saved the file. You already have a flag for which version - 50 files, 500 files, unlimited files & multi user... Why not a flag in the .cty file for which version last saved it?

Free edition, Pro edition, Contributer edition.

The Contributer edition will only open pro files.

The Pro edition will open any files.

The Free edition will only any files.

This way you can download templates when you're evaluating without worrying about what version created it.

Loophole: Someone can download the contributer version, a free template, hit preview, and then copy the files.... Then again, the template won't have their names, it might say "Blog Template" and they couldn't get rid of that.

www.marktaw.com
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Be careful mucking about with the Free edition - loading an existing sample/site with the intention of cutting it down to fit the 50 file limit is something I've done. Not being able to do it may have put me off, don’t know.
My solution to the old problem (although redundant at this point) was access to the database:
Home - local database opened exclusively. Unlimited files. Viability relying on volume of sales to bloggers, hobbyists, ...
Pro - located on a network and multi-user. I have no idea what else you could have offered to make the leap attractive but I’m sure there’s something.
It may have worked - but then I don't really know the problem :)
Now, it would appear, you're into a anti-piracy type of scenario:
http://www.hower.org/Kudzu/Articles/Piracy/index.html
sorting it out may cost more than it’s worth.
My 0.02 (Cdn too, that’s cheap :)

Dave
Saturday, July 26, 2003

"Some of my ideas:
1) Contributor Edition only works on files that were created with the Pro Edition
2) Contributor Edition is not for sale standalone, but only in packages including one copy of the Pro Edition
3) Starter Edition can't open sites with more than 50 pages... a stricter rule than the current rule that allows the Starter Edition to *publish* sites with more than 50 pages.
4) Only one Edition can be installed on a given computer at a given time
5) Trust that people won't figure this out"

Here are my thoughts on your ideas:
1) How about files created with the Home Edition? And older sites created with the Starter Edition that I wish to continue to use?
2) This option seems like the best one. Then you could even make a special offer, "buy 1 and get 1 Contributer for half price", or something. Also, no new code would be needed, so you save some time. And people need something to create the site to begin with, so why would you buy it stand-alone anyways???
3) What if I want a friend to see how a CD site works and asks him to install the Starter Edition to preview the site?
4) What if the person using the Contributer Edition is using the same computer?
5) Well I figured it out so... but you could be right that it would only be a very few people that would do this, and you probably wouldn't loose to much money.

I have another thought, by the way; should users of the Contributer Edition be able to see the directory structure, templates etc? Shouldn't the user just be able to save the text directly to a folder, without being bothered by all the other stuff, which is not possible to edit anyways?

Thomas D
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Joel wrote:
Some of my ideas:
1) Contributor Edition only works on files that were created with the Pro Edition

In my opinion this is the best idea. CE is (will be) a new product and a great idea. There is no end to all the combinations of situations with old files that some people would like to view/edit or whatever with CE. But that is just too bad. If they really want it that bad they could import the old stuff into the new CD Pro and then view it with CE ... but that way they wouldn't get a free ride, oh dear, oh dear! Why do we have to pay for the good stuff, they cry. Well, why do you think?

Jorgen Brenting
Saturday, July 26, 2003

I'm getting all confused about the consequences for folks I have done or might do sites for and where their path might lead once they get their hands on some version of CityDesk. Might be just fine.

Seems like the two issues were the 500 file limit and users accidentally getting into designers view and mucking up a .cty file. Looks like you could fix those without a lot of new additions, name changes or complications.

I still might want somebody with Pro edition not to mess with a particular .cty file. My current home edition folks can now, and if they upgrade will still be able to screw up a site. But I'd be happy if they could mess up their own sites. Suppose the person with "Contributor" edition decides to get "Pro" - I guess that will allow them to cause trouble.

I'm sure the Fog folks have thought better than I'm able to so far.

tk
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Contributor edition file count limits contingent upon the Pro/Home Edition installed.

...
Saturday, July 26, 2003

I meant Starter edition...

...
Saturday, July 26, 2003

good idea ..., of course the whole idea behind the contributer edition is you don't have to have the pro version installed, so it should be based on the .cty file - where it came from.

www.marktaw.com
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Yeah, that's what I was getting at...  It was more of a prediction than a suggestion though.  We'll see?!?

...
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Data point: at the moment, you cannot tell what flavor of CD created a particular CTY file. And putting a flag in the file isn't really a great way to mark it, since anyone with Access could change the flag.

Mike Gunderloy
Saturday, July 26, 2003

OK not a flag... an encrypted string of text that tells you which version of citydesk last saved the file. Try forging that.

Of course, hackers will find the right string and post it somewhere, but there ought to be a clever solution to this.

www.marktaw.com
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Creating a Access database property and checking for it with the Contributor Edition would seem the most expedient way of dealing with the problem. Having said that, it's not too much further to get to allowing Contributor Editions to open only certain databases depending on who's logged on to the machine.

Dave
Saturday, July 26, 2003

Anyone willing to go to the extent of hacking isn't going to be bothering with the Contributor edition - they'll be running a pirated master every-where.

Dave
Saturday, July 26, 2003

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