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Can I torn off "Published by Fog Creek Software"

I've set my site up to use a template that contains a style sheet with several <div> tags in the html. CIty desk puts the "<!-- Published by Fog Creek Software CityDesk KVJABTZUEVAFWFSW/36F6094/2 -->" line at the top of each generated article. This line screws up my layout. Is there anyway to turn this feature off or atleast control where the comment goes.

Thanks!

Marshall Harrison
Saturday, May 11, 2002

The symbols "<!-- -->" denote a comment in the html file and therefore is ignored by browsers. In what way is it causing your layout to go awry as I fail to see how it can?

John C
Sunday, May 12, 2002

What I meant to say was: I fail to see how it can cause problems. But as it is, what's the problem?

John C
Sunday, May 12, 2002

John,

You can see an example at http://www.digitalambitions.com/news.html

The first article and the news page look correct and don't have the comment. Article Number 2 has the comment and as you shoud see the size of the text area gets narrower and the area with the logo gets taller.

This is my first attemp at using stylesheets and perhaps I'm doing something wrong. But - the stylesheet is the same between both articles and they behave differently.

I stlli need to tweek the news page and provide some real content before I can polace the links on the main page.

Thanks.

Marshall Harrison
Sunday, May 12, 2002

John,

As you said I don't see how/why a comment would affect the way the page displays. I've been developing websites for years but have never usde stylesheets until now. I find myself liking sytlesheets but there is a lot to learn about placing items in the page.

Marshall Harrison
Sunday, May 12, 2002

The main page and article #2 differ. One uses inline styles and one uses a linked stylesheet.

In order to reproduce, what you need is two COMPLETELY identical files, one with the comment and one without. I can tell you right now, though, that the placement of that particular comment could not possibly cause rendering problems. What's rendered is what's inside the <body> tags, and that comment isn't in there.

Brad Wilson
Sunday, May 12, 2002

You can use a global search and replace on the produced file tree. I use ultraedit w/ regex search or some unix script to do it.
I do not like having those kinds of comments around.

Philippe Back
Monday, May 13, 2002

Brad,

It's good to see you still here after moving away from CityDesk.

Thanks for pointing out that the main page uses inline styles. I missed that and will change it this evening as I work on a long list of things.

The problem isn't about inline vs linked styles (both have the same styles setup). The Getting Started With CityDesk article also uses a linked style (as does the part of my site that is in production) but it is not broken.

If the article contains the comment line at the top it breaks the style. Is there a way to "fix" the syle or turn off the comment insertion?

Marshall Harrison
Monday, May 13, 2002

It seems quite obtrusive to me to put this in. What is the reference number, is it unique to each customer of fog creek?

Tony E
Monday, May 13, 2002

Thanks Philippe.

I don't mind the comment so much as I mind it breaking my stylesheet. I use Homesite for most of my editing so I'll probably end up doing as you do and let Homesite's global find and replace remove the line from every file in the articles subdiretory. Either that or find a way to "fix" the stylesheet.

Marshall Harrison
Monday, May 13, 2002

Tony,

Are you referrring to the number in the comment? If so then I'm not sure but I hope that number is at least consistent across all of my articles (must check that this evening). 

Marshall Harrison
Monday, May 13, 2002

The comment is a unique identifier that allows you to "Choose Edit with CityDesk from the Internet Explorer toolbar."  The crazy number "JXLXAXFNKLTGDDMH/15B9A3A8/6" identifies, the .cty file, that page, and your computer.

When you install CityDesk, you get an "Edit" icon in IE. One of the options is "Edit with CityDesk."  So, you are surfing a page and notice a mistake.  If you "Edit with CityDesk,"  CityDesk will use the comment to ID your City site, open that site and, that article.  It's been very convenient for me.

TK
Monday, May 13, 2002

Thanks for the explaination TK!

Now if I could jsut keep it from breaking my stylesheet.

Marshall Harrison
Monday, May 13, 2002

Remove this: "MARGIN: 1em 10%;" from your DIV.main style in your stylesheet. Seems to work fine on my machine when you do...

John C
Monday, May 13, 2002

John C.

I tried that (Article Nmmber 3 on the site) and that created another problem. Now the main text area is the proper size but it moved over to the left so it is still different from the other pages which are centered.

Maybe I'll figure out the stylesheet stuff one day.

Marshall Harrison
Monday, May 13, 2002

Yeah, it's definitely something to do with the style although it doesn't make a whole lot of sense why putting a comment in should make any difference. Probably an IE bug...

John C
Monday, May 13, 2002

Just curious...

What exactly does the DOCTYPE statement do? If I remove this statement from the first page the formatting fails like the second page. Also, if I move the comment line below the doctype statement the formatting of the second page is fine.

The DOCTYPE must be setting something up that must be done immediately and placing the comment above it screws that up.

Stu
Monday, May 13, 2002

Good point! This might be the very reason of the problem.

According to some (http://www.htmlhelp.com/tools/validator/doctype.html):

Each HTML document must begin with a document type declaration that declares which version of HTML the document adheres to. HTML 4.0 comes in three flavors, each with a different DOCTYPE: ...

The standard specifies though that the CityDesk comment is legal.

An HTML 4 document is composed of three parts:
- a line containing HTML version information,
- a declarative header section (delimited by the HEAD element),
- a body, which contains the document's actual content. The body may be implemented by the BODY element or the FRAMESET element.

---> White space (spaces, newlines, tabs, and comments) may appear before or after each section. Sections 2 and 3 should be delimited by the HTML element.

Browser bug? Work around would be simple for the CityDesk programmers!
The most correct place would be to fill in the generator tag in the <head>

Adriaan van den Brand
Tuesday, May 14, 2002

that's not so easy -- what if you're a lazy HTML programmer and you didn't provide a head?

Joel Spolsky
Tuesday, May 14, 2002

I've been looking at the site in Netscape (4.7x) and it's SO horrendous I couldn't even locate the links. Just thought I'd let you know.

MarkTAW
Tuesday, May 14, 2002

Thanks for the comments Mark.

I know it has some Netscape 4.x problems but I haven't gotten it to display completely in 4 yet. I haven't really decided if I care or not.

Hopefully you don't think it is "SO horrendous " with newer browsers.

Marshall Harrison
Tuesday, May 14, 2002

Just my 2c... the more sites that look "horrendous" in Netscape 4, the better. That browser isn't worth the bytes it takes on your disk.

Get Mozilla 1.0. Both IE6 and Opera6 have some pretty annoying rendering problems. :)

Brad Wilson
Tuesday, May 14, 2002

I appreciate the help everyone has provided. I have finally finished the site. I hand coded most of the site with CityDesk generating the Tech News page and the articles. It is my first real CityDesk attempt and it took a while to get everything broken out into templates and variables. Hopefully you will consider the effort worth while.

I still haven't adressed the Netscape 4 issue and I'm inclined to agree with Brad. As long as we keep pampering the older browsers by dumbing down our websites the longer they will stay around. It's time for older browsers to die.

Thanks again for all of the suppport.

Marshall Harrison
Tuesday, May 14, 2002

It's rather strange, but none of the pages on my site produced by Citydesk seem to have that kind of tag in them. Is this good or bad? I don't ever use that "edit with Citydesk" command in IE, so in that sense I don't miss it.

I don't use style-sheets, either; just tables and old fashioned things.

My direct HTML files contain a comment "generated by Citydesk" but not funny serial number. Oddly enough, they also all say "CityDesk 1.0.1" even though I upgraded to 1.0.27 quite a while ago.

Individual entries which are Citydesk "articles" don't have any CityDesk comment in them at all.

(in case anyone's interested: http://denbeste.nu )

Steven C. Den Beste
Wednesday, May 15, 2002

The comment only appears if (a) it's an article, as opposed to a file, and (b) the extension is .htm or .html.

(I was too scared to put in the comment if we weren't sure that the file type was .html.)

Joel Spolsky
Wednesday, May 15, 2002

Well, that explains it. I'm using .shtml because I'm using server-side scripts to implement hit counters.

Steven C. Den Beste
Wednesday, May 15, 2002

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